Til Death Dues Me Apart

[zesty_pinto]

$2,500 is no easy sum. With $2,500, I can get:

- a new current-gen full-frame DSLR
- a mid-range telephoto
- a pretty damn good prime lens (unless you use medium format)
- a really high end custom computer rig, complete with monitor and penile-enlarging peripherals with rainbow LEDs all over it
- a damn decent week in a nice hotel off-peak season

Which is why I spent the last 12 hours griping that I put $2,500 on
- a wedding deposit

Yup, the axe has fallen and we checked the calendar and we are good to go with the wedding thing. Sigh.

If you're wondering why I am so depressed about this time of joy, it was because I was told from Michelle's relatives that their estimates rounded to about a little over 6k. I reminded them time and again that I didn't want to have a ceremony because of cost, while Michelle was insistent that we wouldn't have money problems doing this. I kept running the numbers in my head and it meant that in order for us to pay back everything, the 50 guests that are coming would be expected to put in 200 dollars per plate. That's not including a photographer, music, chauffeur (the location is in the middle of nowhere and there's going to be liquor because it's Portuguese), let alone the liquor costs.

I bit my lip and called the manager there and gave them my credit card info. Ironically, I checked my credit card and $2,500 is also just enough to pay off my credit card so I could work on Michelle's debt (she's still at $15k, another problem all to itself), so my debt load doubled for this wedding so far and that's not including the $7.5k I need to handle once it gets to September.

By the way, After the end of March, I was predicting I would have finished my debt once and for all.

You have no idea how many fathoms of anger I was holding in versus the rage I was screaming into a pillow at how much all my hopes to buy a house this year have officially been shitcanned thanks to this revelation.

Michelle's parents, the people who pushed us into having a ceremony to begin with, offered to cover $5k of the debt load, mentioning that the guests will probably cover the rest.

I'm very skeptical about this and couldn't sit still because it's still $100/person for a ceremony where people will be renting hotel rooms up in VT just to attend this thing as well.

In my own inability to feel human, I crammed myself into the carpet walkway between the bed and slept there covered in pillows in some sort of weird penance for thinking I would ever be debt free and just lay there, feeling sorry for myself until 4 in the morning when my body finally cooled off. Despite that, I still feel hot just thinking about how much I knew this was going to happen and how much I did not want a ceremony because of how much it would set our debts back.

The next time I'm around them, I'm going to mention the second job to them. Michelle didn't want me to, but I give up and I want to emphasize just how bad our debt load was even before this just so they are aware of how much their desires are pushing us back. I think they feel bad a bit because I think they heard me swear out loud after making the deposit.

We're going to be 26k in debt in total, her and me. I can only work on this job until September, after which I will quit the second job because their time requirements make it impossible for me to keep everyone happy given how troublesome Christmas and Thanksgiving was. That means if I can keep this ship right and neither of us have any medical expenses, then that's an extra $2.5k I can probably put into the finance pool and that I'll probably put aside for covering more of the wedding.

Michelle feels bad and she knows I am upset and has offered to throw in money, but I keep telling her that as a couple we need to handle debts equally and she's sinking faster than me, so I'm going to handle most of the debt load for this. It pisses me off, but I'm going to be more angry if I see this lead to her stay at $15k in debt and live with $200+ in service charges as a result of this empty gesture.

As a perpetual pessimist, I think we are, at best, going to break even. Michelle said that if that's the case then at least we did good. I keep telling her that this won't include the finance charges from the debt itself.

I have no idea to predict how much we can handle, but I'm going to try, I'm probably going to cry, and if I'm lucky then maybe I can keep a smile through the entire wedding without snapping at someone for an event that makes everyone but me happy.

I know as well that this isn't even the worst it can go. I'm still aware that Vermont weddings average around $37k; I still would rather we went on a honeymoon somewhere where we didn't work our asses off just to break even.

I hate everything right now. This might persist for another month or so, depending on how my checkbooks look. I'll try to be more entertaining in another post, just needed to vent this thick stream of pure unfiltered haterade.

Comments

[zesty_pinto]

This is the most untraditional as we could get with it. We're not getting bridesmaids/groomsmen. The "ceremony" is only a five minute thing (that we're paying 500 for). I tried to push to Michelle to get something that can be reused in future wardrobes and she's been uncertain about this. I'm still going to need to think about putting 2k aside for other expenses because I have no idea how much it'll be to get some of the other things for this ceremony accounted for.

I've spent the last 48 hours expressing how unhappy this has been while punching through a timeline on how to pay this off while paying off Michelle's debts. I will get over it in time, but this one is going to be a sensitive point on me for awhile and I'm just going to be open that I've been scrubbing toilets on my off hours just to pay off our debts and how we're at a point in our life where a spontaneous charge like getting a car and its other additional things will cripple our finances (I was scheduled to be finished with my debt by January otherwise).

[notasupervillain]

Okay, so, speaking as a woman who didn't have much money and hated traditional weddings anyway:

There is SO FUCKING MUCH social pressure on a woman to have a traditional wedding. Not just the idea that since basically kindergaten I was raised to think about what colours I'd want and what my dress would look like. But once I announced I was engaged, the pressure became really intense. "You need flowers". "I don't want to pay for flowers, I hate flowers." "But what will you do with your hands in the photos?" Every single fucking detail becomes a fight. And every single detail costs money.

I was bridesmaid last summer and it was BRUTAL. Her parents contributed money, and they thought that meant they got to dictate what their money was spent on. What would the guests say if there wasn't a candy bar? It's the little touches that matter. Her dress was gorgeous, but the important thing was that "she wore it, the dress didn't wear her". It cost at least one order of magnitude more than my dress, and I've worn my dress since - most recently with a blazer to a job interview. It was far more beautiful than my dress, though. And this was my special day, the one day of my life I got to be a princess, the one day of me life that was "about me". And I didn't buy my princess dress.

I get what you're feeling, and it's fucking bullshit, but I have sympathy for Michelle too. If her social network is anything like mine, she's going to be under incredibly intense pressure to pay for every detail, and you as the husband (assuming your gender, apologies if I guessed wrong, no way to see someone's gender presentation over the internet) will face maybe 10% of the social backlash she'll get. Though. You're right.

[zesty_pinto]

Ugh, thanks for the perspective check. Michelle probably has been pushed about this as well and that's why she's been hesitant every time I kept emphasizing how we would be better off eloping and then putting the real money towards an anniversary "renewal of vows" (imo this is what pisses me off the most about the wedding industry: we should put the money into celebrating people who lasted through the worst, not towards new beginnings), and she's sympathetic enough to understand my thinking, but her friends are really into the traditional thing and I don't think her parents are into that concept either.

When money is tight, and when I want her to stop paying 200 dollars in finance charges, I just keep thinking this is why we can't afford kids for another couple of years. Her parents will offer support, but having kids who were always taught to want while being spoiled by grandparents doesn't sound like a good combo to me. I just... ugh, my pessimism keeps spiking.

And no worries assuming my gender, hah; I would get often confused for a woman. Someone told me that I have a playful, teasing, way about my writing that makes people think it came off as feminine.

[notasupervillain]

Yeah. It totally sucks, and it's exhausting to keep saying no to people who love you when they suggest things for your wedding that they think will make you happier. And, depending on your cultural background, it can be pretty embarrasing to say that it's cause you can't afford anything else.

In terms of cheap weddings - is it possible to do a destination wedding, with your families, in Mexico/Cuba/something similar? I have friends who did that, and if you do it properly it can be quite inexpensive but still end up with gorgeous photos. Plus, it's a week long holiday on the beach to go with it, with all your family and friends. I think of it as the "between" option that's not eloping but not as expensive as traditional. Though it's not gonna work for lots of families.

I agree about the wedding industry being parasidic. And it hits people who need money for a morgage or kids or (in my case) a working visa. Not old people who've had a lifetime to save. But there's no escaping the pressure if you're born a woman.

Lol I feel less guilty for assuming male then!

[zesty_pinto]

Hah, technically where we live is the destination wedding. Vermont isn't a cheap place for it though, though doing it in fall is supposed to be cheaper? We chose September which is between the harvest seasons, not late enough to get the fall colors though, but early enough to still do all the fruit picking and whatnot that you normally associate with that time of the year, so I think the food selection should reflect that. The silver lining is I can can a ton of things as wedding gifts, so we're trying to find ways to cut the costs where we can, I just really didn't want it to be this much!

And don't feel guilty! Seriously, I consider it a badge of honor to be seen as so gender fluid in my writing style. I've heard worse remarks just for being Asian and typing like this.

[notasupervillain]

Give everyone maple syrup do it.

It sounds like you have a handle on things as best you can. But price-wise, I budget $1000-2000 every time someone asks me to be a bridesmaid. Like, as soon as someone attaches the word "wedding" to any party the price goes up.

I know someone who bought her dress online from China, and loved it, though I've already heard that if you don't love the dress the shipping to return it is so expensive that it ends up costing more than the dress itself. I also know someone who got a used dress and got it altered, and a couple people who had their dresses made by friends. Oh, and someone who bought a white "engagement party" dress instead of a "wedding dress" - but she had to go inside a wedding dress shop to find that, and d those saleswomen are TOUGH. They're on commission and they make their commission. If Michelle can find a dress she loves any of those ways? But honestly if she steps inside a wedding dress shop, it might be all over. One of my friends has your attitude towards weddings, stepped in a shop, talked to the saleslady and left with over a thousand dollars in a dress.

The whole industry is a trap.


Okay, of course people are racist about everything but what the fuck people are racist about WRITING? How? Why? Why must humanity be like this?

[zesty_pinto]

Yeeah, that's the 2000s for you. It was one of the reasons why I pushed into inceldom since I wasn't big on traditional dating and most of the time the whole asian=ugly thing was pretty commonplace in the chatrooms I frequented. To be fair, if I wasn't so work-screwed, then maybe I could have been more normal, but shyness doesn't equate well into finding work, so...

But yeah, that's my college-to-post-college years for you! Things have been changing, thank god, but I also know there's much to do, and I honestly feel like being able to dig myself out of the sitch makes me that much more sympathetic for those stuck in there to begin with (and to be honest, I think most folks need to understand desperation like that just to grow out of it properly).

[notasupervillain]

Oh man that is so many levels of messed up. I am so sorry you went through that, and so glad you got out. I'm glad it built character but no one should have to go through that kind of character building.

[zesty_pinto]

It's fine, and I agree that not everyone should have to deal with it. It does make it easy for me to understand a lot of these fringers though, though it also comes with me acknowledging what an idiot I was back in the day, so I keep hoping that some of these guys stop staying so close to the deep end.

I remember enough to know that if you can find yourself in a bubble that keeps you there long enough, it gets really hard to get out. I feel lucky enough to have been this way when there were very few people out there admitting it, at least in my circles. For those in incel sites, I can see it very easy to get in deeper, especially since a lot of fringe violent groups are looking for folks at their most vulnerable like that to give them purpose as weapons for their agenda.

[notasupervillain]

I hope more people get out. It's really scary for me as someone who would be a victim of violence from a radicalized individual. But I agree that the person who gets radicalized to violence is a victim too. It's easy to fall into a toxic environment and get stuck, and get preyed on. Only as a woman, I don't tend to get pushed towards violence when that happens, and men do.

I don't know what we do about it, but it's not good.

[zesty_pinto]

I should add to thank you for this talk, it really is grounding me a lot more. I've been telling Michelle I just can't even handle being around her for the past few days because of all... this--between this, the weekend where we got home super late because she made us prioritize everything around her parents' lackadaisical schedule, and this weekend where we just drove around for four hours doing nothing to waste time to get that estimate made it incredibly difficult for me to be around her.

[notasupervillain]

My husband and I had fights around our wedding. I still make fun of him for the car ride down to the cottage where he nearly got the wedding cancelled:

Him: this is so great and it's all come together like magic
Me, suspicious: what do you mean like magic?
Him: everyone was available to come and we got a great cottage to rent and there were places in nearby motels for guests to stay and we have all the supplies we need to host, it just so came together
Me: it didn't come together I worked my ass off to make it work out, I spent hours on the phone and writing emails and making lists, why do you think I've been so stressed out lately?
Him: I dunno, you get stressed out a lot?

Weddings are like a fucking second full time job in terms of workload, especially the closer you get to the day. I've told my husband that we can never get divorced because I'm never going through a wedding again. The joke at my friend's wedding was that if a couple can survive the wedding without breaking up, you know they can get through anything.